TMA vs. MMA: The Great Debate!

TMA vs. MMA: The Great Debate!

Hey. Ando here from Happy Life Martial Arts. Traditional Martial Arts and Mixed Martial
Arts. The trash talking between these two camps
has been going on for decades now. Personally, I’ve been training in traditional
martial arts for most of my life, but I’ve also bought more than a few UFC pay-per-views. Yup. I’m a fan of both. Which is why I end up arguing with myself
all the time…


100 thoughts on “TMA vs. MMA: The Great Debate!”

  • Ando-sensei, I bowed several times to you in this video because of the wisdom you've given me. Thank you for this impressive video!

    P.S. I do traditional and I have gained more respect for the MMA community thanks to you. ๐Ÿ˜€

  • Vincent van der Veen says:

    Great video sir๐Ÿ˜‚ You know I started out in tma and I have done mma for years now. I love tma but the problem with it lies in the training methods. You need to do strength training, conditioning training and real sparring to make sure your techniques are effective. Tma schools who do this have a far higher succes rate than tma schools who don't. Everything works, and nothing works. It all depends on how you train. Ofcourse there are some techniques that are more effective than others in some ways. A muay thai roundhouse kick has far more power than a taekwondo one, but a taekwondo roundhouse kick gets his power from his speed. That is why a taekwondo kick is better for head kicks and a muay thai kick is better for body kicks. But all things aside, just pick the martial art that works for you and that you enjoy, so we can all have a happy live.

  • Sensei you going to keep it up and they going to give you some medicine and they going to put you in a straight jacket you better stop now since a

  • Very well done! It actually felt like 2 different people. ๐Ÿ˜๐Ÿ‘Œ
    Lots of good points. Also lots of lol's… like the 'couples counselling' style pseudo-compliments bit! ๐Ÿ˜„
    Personally, I like to employ both TMA & MMA approaches, without totally drinking the Kool-Aid of either… ๐Ÿ˜

  • Uh, how about MMA foundation is from TMA, MMA is a combination of various TMA used for Brutal ring fighting. TMA used more for conditioning the mind and body. Lastly, Outside of the ring, MMA have a lot more of a realistic success rate, than TMA.

  • I think the age of MMA vs TMA is over. Most MMA practitioners value TMA for its wealth of knowledge that helps MMA skillsets. Weโ€™ve had too many Lyoto Machidas and Wonderboys to turn our noses up at TMA. And it seems like everyone today is looking to clip their opponent with that spinning back kick.

  • TMA teaches us a way of life. My sensei teaches martial artists, not martial arts. Itโ€™s a way of being in the world, and it serves me well, I am fortunate to have the honor of being a martial artist , much respect for my sensei for this.

  • I actually don't comment on the videos but I had to here because this one video compelled me to comment after 2 fuckin yrs ,
    It's the amount of effort that this man poured into this stufff it's litttt๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ”ฅ

  • ๐Ÿป Both styles are awesome!!!๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ’ฏ๐Ÿ’ฏ๐Ÿ’ฏ๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ”ฅ๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ˜€๐Ÿ˜€๐Ÿ˜€๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ‘Š๐Ÿ‘Š๐Ÿ‘Š"Just had a bro moment"!!!

  • Within both sides there's narrow minded and open minded people. Definitely prefer the open minded ones. By now it has also been shown that a number of the techniques deemed unrealistic from TMA can work in MMA, as long as you know how to fight. It is one thing to study fighting and learn fighting techniques, but pressure testing and sparring is essential for learning to use those techniques in a dynamic unpredictable context where you gotta be able to take and give. I'm more than anything else a TMA guy, but I train both BJJ, Kickboxing, Krav Maga, Kung Fu, etc. ๐Ÿ™‚

  • If you've not seen it already, here's a good vid on the value of different martial arts, including MMA / TMA from Art of One Dojo.

  • The only real issue I see with most traditional martial arts schools is the lack of physical conditioning. However on the flip side I've seen many traditional martial art schools where the training was tough and those schools tended to lose students because people weren't willing to put in the work to develop the skills. Example being if you want to stab with your fingers you will have to condition the hell out of your fingers. It's honestly a weird balance. The honest truth though is that there are no styles only principles for attack and conditioning.

  • Matthew Van Helden says:

    Great video.
    Bjj is a good mix between a traditional martial art and a modern evolved one thats practical. That's why I like it

  • the yin and yang(ooops!thats it is a TMA cocept!!).A former kickboxer and wrestler,instructor of TMA(chuan -fa.Taichi chuan and Tangsoodo)

  • I primarily focus on a select few TMA groups that follow the same principles of conditioning, live sparring, and pressure testing that MMA extols, but is not always the best at conversing with TMA about. True, TMA people can have a recalcitrant and ignoble attitude towards MMA, but the MMA dogmatists (people who swear MMA is the only valid system to train in) are not helping matters either. There has to be a middle ground between the extremes.

    In Karate: Karate Culture, Jesse Enkamp, Ian Abernathy, and even Karate Combat

    In Kung Fu: You Ando, Randy Brown of Mantis Boxing, Sergio Perez of Practical Combat Martial Arts, even TIm Cartmell of Ground Dragon Martial Arts

    In Silat: The Professional Pentjak Silat Championship, Sean Stark of Guerrilla Silat, and Burton Richardson's Fuctional Silat/Silat for the Street

    This comment is, admittedly, verbose, but that is because the subject is that complex. It is easy to oversimplify into logical fallacy in both camps, but the important thing is to be honest, train honestly if you wish to defend yourself, and hold people to account when they are being dishonest about what they are teaching.

  • I didn't know there were any footage of MMA fighters getting knocked out by just a single punch.
    Anyway, there's much to say about the supposed "realness" of MMA. I suggest people to go through the long list of MMA rules designed to prevent the fighters from getting really hurt. They are of course good to have, but they also separate MMA from a streetfight.

  • blockmasterscott says:

    Iโ€™m as traditional as anyone can be(I train in combat tai chi and Choy Li Fut), but I always talk shop with my MMA friends.

    They try their stuff on me and I try my stuff on them. I even have a friend that takes American boxing that I talk to about fighting.

    One thing thatโ€™s happened is that we all learned a lot from each other.

  • BEST MMA VS TMA DEBATE EVER๐Ÿ˜‚. The quality of your content is second to none sensei. Thanks ALOT๐Ÿ’—๐Ÿ™๐Ÿ™

  • Atti Ylรคnen says:

    Well, almost all the techniques used in MMA come from TMA. There's no quarrel that MMA tested techniques do work. However, because we are talking about arts, there are many techniques that don't seem to work in MMA, like certain types of blocks that require catching a punch and gripping the arm. But some of them do of course work. Like fancy kicks.
    Joe Rogan explained it great. Something along like this. Taekwondo has impressive kicks like the wheel kick, axe kick, tornado kick etc. A good kicker can make them work in the cage, but they need to be learned in TMA to become really good at them. Because if you try to learn fancy kicks in front of a high school wrestler, you are constantly being taken down. In order to learn fancy kicks, you need to learn the techinque "without interruptions", you need shielded training in TMA like taekwondo that don't use low kicks, punches to the head or wrestling. If one wants to learn kicking, I would suggest to go and build the foundation of your kicks in a TMA that has especialized in kicking techniques. Then learn boxing and wrestling, or better yet, learn wrestling first as it is the foundation of MMA, if you want to be a MMA fighter, that is. Anyway, great training to all. Fighting sports build up the character of a man.

  • Axis Ces53 Angelphase says:

    What a lot of people never mention in this dicussion..TMA vs MMA ๐Ÿ™‚ Is WHY do you train ?? There are 4 different basic reasons…. 1 to LARP ( nothing wrong, just having fun playing a fantasy role as Ninja or Samurai …) 2 to build better character and stay in shape… 3 for sport competition… 4 for self defense… Those are very different reasons, and have different answers… Then the factor of the quality of training, and how much input you put in training… All those variables can differ so much, that giving a straight answer to this question is not so easy and straight forward… Also people tend to think as martial arts styles as a shelf product, which is not a realistic way of looking at it.. Instant buy …instant skill…ahhaha…Like if i start MMA I instantly am a Chuck Liddel, of course it does not work like that… ๐Ÿ˜‰ Last but not least…ALL techinques in MMA come form TMA …so …what is the discussion really about ??? Training methodes ???… is the key, ALL techniques if drilled, could work… If I start training "spitting in the eye" technique for 6 hours a day for 10 years…that technique will work…soooooo, cheers Ando, love your channel…clever answers to hard questions… ๐Ÿ™‚

  • BTW Steven Seagal also said (probably): "One extra bowl – or two – of Russka solyanka never hurt anyone" – now look at him! Not MMA not TMA but LDL is what got him!

  • Great Video I train in TMA, but I know lots of MMA guys who are very open minded to traditional arts. And don"t act like that (at least around me) Alot of the people eho bash TMA, are just douchbags behind a keyboard. I bet you half of them dont even train in the first place.

  • Great video! I was an amateur boxer for a very long time and one of the things that stuck out the most to me was how different boxing gyms could have massively different "feels". Sure we were all doing the same drills, same light and heavy sparring, but some gyms attracted a meaner crowd of boxers than others. There were some gyms that seemed to attract students who were there specifically to learn how to hurt people. These gyms were the worst because you couldn't trust your sparring partners. Plus violent people tend to have other personal and emotional problems, they are not good at hiding or keeping from effecting the people around them. So actually learning to be a better boxer at these places was impossible. You can't spar if you don't trust your partner not to lose it midway!

    The problem I have with MMA is the worry that an MMA dojo is more likely to attract the types of violent angry people that can turn the training floor into a dangerous volatile place. And it seems to me that MMA schools purposefully try to attract this type of student and market themselves accordingly.

    My problem with MMA isn't the style, it's the marketing and who they are trying to pull into their doors.

  • That was great man, the point I like the more is HOW MANY FIGHTS I AVOIDED, and that is the real wisdom of martial artist, MMA is more sports. Thank You Very Much Ando. Good sense everytime

  • I don't know, I have a feeling if the traditional martial artists try to start a kumbaya sing along, the MMA guys will just jump out and start trying to choke everyone. I think you should get a point of view from one of THE most feared and respected traditional stylists and that's Rex Kwon Do himself. Please get him on your show!!!

  • I would argue that mma is basically turning into its own martial arts, you can even hear it in the way people talk about it, "I practice MMA" So in some time maybe it will be called a TMA?

  • ู…ุญู…ุฏ ุญุณุงู… says:

    I just wanna point out something TMA and MMA are no different . It is more like MMA takes the best of skills of TMA and puts it together , So when you practise MMA you are practising Karate and Taekwando kicks Juijutsu Chokes and throws and also modern punches ..etc. So MMA is a collection of both traditional and modern martial arts' techniques . I mean TMA is kinda the roots for MMA . That's the way I see it

  • This whole debate is not very precise as a topic…
    Mma is the modern form of Pankration, a martial art / combat sport based in Wrestling and Boxing (Olympic debut in 648 B.C.) – doesn't get more traditional than that.
    Maybe the debate should be: Asian Martial Arts VS MMA

  • This appeals to my Libra tendencies to need to balance out every bodies viewpoints and ultimately see both points of view as truth

  • I have respect for both but everyone's entitled to their own opinion it doesn't matter if you practice TMA or MMA we are all fighting for a happy life !

  • One of the best videos I've seen so far. Contains highly intelligent conversation as well as great sense of humor, plus the wise conculsion at the end. I salute you for this work Sir.

  • This is wonderful — witty, entertaining, thoughtful & uplifting. I've been studying TKD for 9 years (head instructor has done MMA too) and have been thinking about trying out some new styles to expand my skills (& get my ass kicked more frequently). It's easy to get a little discouraged though, by all of the nonsensical back-and-forth one sees online. Your message really encourages an open mind & positive energy.

  • Awesome Sensei! MMA is the most scientific in a scuffle, but there is a lot to gain from the Traditional Martial Arts, like the training. Just learning Drunken Kung Fu is very unusual and quite the workout. I'm an RMA fan, and I know that a blue belt in Jiu-Jitsu can give RMA a run for its money. I like both styles. But I do believe in working hard on ourselves, or working harder on ourselves than we do at our 9 to 5 job. Thank you for the video!

  • This is such an incredible video. You you one smart guy to put this together. The unbiased points kept coming and kept me on the edge of my seat. You were meant for tv, get off of YouTube, and Instagram ๐Ÿ˜œ

  • Francesco Caglio says:

    I would like to add that even every TMA was born as a mixed martial art, being eclectic to be functional on the battlefield or for self defense.
    And talking about MMA as a specific martial art system, is against its spirit. MMA is born as a way to make traditional martial arts competing each other .

    In the movie Birth of the Dragon ,they say:
    The technique is a trap and the style is a prison.
    Kungfu (and every other martial arts) was meant to set the man free

  • dennis michel Klein says:

    It isn't the TMA or MMA that makes the difference.
    It is the person who practice Martial arts.
    Karate, taekwondo, MMA etc are just tools for constructing your self defense and your personality.
    Whatever style you choose, it will benefit you ๐Ÿ’ช

  • Waleed The lightning fists says:

    Master ando
    Thats a great content that you are giving us
    Please can you do videos more on kicking (tkd) cause i feel like my kicks are powerless and i dont know the reason

  • ๅŠ‰ๆตฉ็ฆน says:

    I do WTF Taekwondo, ITF Taekwondo, and kickboxing. And I still find my TMA techniques work well in sparring. Also I don't hate MMA people.

  • Lothar Lรผder says:

    Funny Master. Lets see fighting Moneymasters against Funnymasters. And no Rules and Restrictions. Right to the very End.

  • Well said and I hope people get it. Instead of continued feeding of their primitive egoes.
    Only construcktive critisism is productive towards a better healthy future for everyone when other criticisms are deconstrucktive in nature that is not healthy in the future.

  • I (finally) started practicing martial arts some months ago, and I'm loving it. I really appreciate the TMA elements of grace, flexibility and perfecting of technique, but I also want the opportunity do do full contact sparring at some point in time. I don't think cauliflower ears are particularly cool, and I'm not too enthusiastic about rolling on the mat with guys having a desperate urge to break my arm or choke me into oblivion, so I went for something that's somewhere in between (I think) – kickboxing. Great fun, great training and it feels just right for me. A big plus also that most of your training and technique tips apply just as well to kickboxing as they do to TMA.

    Great video! And please continue sharing the timeless wisdom of Steven Seagal.

  • You never disappoint Sensei Ando, that video was well done, thank you. I feel that only the one with biggest ego will proceed to get into that debate/argument. Keep training for a happy life!

  • Michel Banguerski says:

    Let's vote! Like this comment if You believe Ando Sensei made TMA look better, dislike it if You believe he made MMA look better (it could be the other way around, I just had to pick one option).

  • agree that both of TMA and MMA aim for being a better person. But at the skills aspect, i didn't understand why if a person willing to be a better martial artist but refusing gain from other martial arts that can cover his/her own limitation…

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